1 00:00:11,450 --> 00:00:08,120 just can't where I take the conversation 2 00:00:16,460 --> 00:00:11,460 back to is the conspiracies that we both 3 00:00:19,849 --> 00:00:16,470 have run into in in Tim and I in like 4 00:00:23,750 --> 00:00:19,859 I'm telling you when I first ran into 5 00:00:26,210 --> 00:00:23,760 the parapsychology conspiracy when I 6 00:00:28,820 --> 00:00:26,220 first ran into what's that oh I'll 7 00:00:30,800 --> 00:00:28,830 explain our concern for Sheldrick Rupert 8 00:00:32,870 --> 00:00:30,810 why richard wiseman right richard 9 00:00:34,100 --> 00:00:32,880 wiseman dr. richard wiseman there in the 10 00:00:39,160 --> 00:00:34,110 UK one of the most prominent 11 00:00:42,290 --> 00:00:39,170 psychologists in Roberts world words 12 00:00:48,310 --> 00:00:42,300 intentionally deceptive intentionally 13 00:00:50,389 --> 00:00:48,320 deceptive in undermining this idea that 14 00:00:52,790 --> 00:00:50,399 parapsychology could possibly be true 15 00:00:55,729 --> 00:00:52,800 well I ran into that over and over again 16 00:00:58,069 --> 00:00:55,739 to the point where I'm like this is not 17 00:01:01,099 --> 00:00:58,079 accidental this is not people who just 18 00:01:03,709 --> 00:01:01,109 have a different belief system that 19 00:01:05,179 --> 00:01:03,719 they're married to and in particular I 20 00:01:07,750 --> 00:01:05,189 ran into it again with the near-death 21 00:01:11,210 --> 00:01:07,760 experience science where there was this 22 00:01:13,340 --> 00:01:11,220 organized effort we're in sync major 23 00:01:16,100 --> 00:01:13,350 publications would come out so Evan 24 00:01:17,810 --> 00:01:16,110 Alexander publishes a book Harvard 25 00:01:19,490 --> 00:01:17,820 neurosurgeon says I had a near-death 26 00:01:24,770 --> 00:01:19,500 experience BAM 27 00:01:26,990 --> 00:01:24,780 Newsweek cover BAM you know hit BBC all 28 00:01:29,120 --> 00:01:27,000 these news outlets at the same time come 29 00:01:32,210 --> 00:01:29,130 out and attack this guy in a particular 30 00:01:36,590 --> 00:01:32,220 way it doesn't make any sense unless 31 00:01:38,149 --> 00:01:36,600 it's an organized effort to I don't want 32 00:01:41,060 --> 00:01:38,159 to say misinformed but that is my 33 00:01:42,880 --> 00:01:41,070 opinion misinformed I think I really 34 00:01:45,740 --> 00:01:42,890 don't think that's necessary you can say 35 00:01:48,319 --> 00:01:45,750 it's my experience that I lived her and 36 00:01:50,630 --> 00:01:48,329 I could give you 50 hours of I think I 37 00:01:54,560 --> 00:01:50,640 think it's more organic than that you 38 00:01:57,319 --> 00:01:54,570 know the people that I know that bend 39 00:02:00,380 --> 00:01:57,329 their worldview and we'll see what they 40 00:02:02,749 --> 00:02:00,390 see to fit in with it no it isn't 41 00:02:05,090 --> 00:02:02,759 Richard why Sir Richard Wiseman is 42 00:02:07,219 --> 00:02:05,100 called deceptive by Rupert Sheldrake and 43 00:02:10,969 --> 00:02:07,229 a few years later he pops up and he's 44 00:02:12,410 --> 00:02:10,979 called deceptive by Daryl BEM so yeah of 45 00:02:13,910 --> 00:02:12,420 course and if you talk to Susan 46 00:02:15,170 --> 00:02:13,920 Blackmore or someone like that who 47 00:02:18,050 --> 00:02:15,180 I don't really don't think as a 48 00:02:19,360 --> 00:02:18,060 deceptive woman she will say the people 49 00:02:24,199 --> 00:02:19,370 who are doing the cycle the 50 00:02:26,600 --> 00:02:24,209 parapsychology work are deceptive that 51 00:02:28,400 --> 00:02:26,610 you're just not right at it I tell my 52 00:02:31,370 --> 00:02:28,410 story with Susan Blackmore I interviewed 53 00:02:33,050 --> 00:02:31,380 Susan Blackmore about her position on 54 00:02:35,270 --> 00:02:33,060 near-death experience and she totally 55 00:02:37,580 --> 00:02:35,280 caved I mean this is public you can go 56 00:02:39,770 --> 00:02:37,590 listen to the interview and she says you 57 00:02:42,110 --> 00:02:39,780 know what the the research really has 58 00:02:44,570 --> 00:02:42,120 passed me by I shouldn't speak on it 59 00:02:46,040 --> 00:02:44,580 because I just shot down her last gasp 60 00:02:48,380 --> 00:02:46,050 of the dying brain and this other 61 00:02:50,420 --> 00:02:48,390 [\h__\h] that they still peddle out 62 00:02:54,380 --> 00:02:50,430 there so that was her conclusion very 63 00:02:57,530 --> 00:02:54,390 nice very proper very admirable to say 64 00:02:59,360 --> 00:02:57,540 you know I really am not as well 65 00:03:00,740 --> 00:02:59,370 informed as I should be because I 66 00:03:03,130 --> 00:03:00,750 hammered her pretty hard on the data 67 00:03:05,690 --> 00:03:03,140 later that month she went and gave a 68 00:03:07,970 --> 00:03:05,700 presentation on how the near-death 69 00:03:09,949 --> 00:03:07,980 experience sciences bunk and it doesn't 70 00:03:11,539 --> 00:03:09,959 hold up but the other examples that I 71 00:03:13,699 --> 00:03:11,549 was trying to give you but that's a 72 00:03:17,330 --> 00:03:13,709 clear example of what I'm saying is that 73 00:03:19,840 --> 00:03:17,340 susan has made a personal journey when I 74 00:03:23,030 --> 00:03:19,850 met her I met her at University 75 00:03:25,190 --> 00:03:23,040 wait she was she was she was doing 76 00:03:27,620 --> 00:03:25,200 research into that then but she was a 77 00:03:29,840 --> 00:03:27,630 parapsychologist then she wants she was 78 00:03:31,099 --> 00:03:29,850 actually looking to inform she wanted to 79 00:03:33,500 --> 00:03:31,109 back up parapsychology I was an 80 00:03:35,720 --> 00:03:33,510 experimental subject for her she then 81 00:03:37,250 --> 00:03:35,730 made a journey to the other side and now 82 00:03:39,020 --> 00:03:37,260 she don't think there's some organized 83 00:03:40,849 --> 00:03:39,030 conspiracy to write Susan you need to go 84 00:03:43,610 --> 00:03:40,859 out and tell these lies it's like she 85 00:03:47,020 --> 00:03:43,620 has a predisposition to do that because 86 00:03:49,430 --> 00:03:47,030 of her own her own story I don't believe 87 00:03:53,210 --> 00:03:49,440 something manipulating all of this this 88 00:03:55,789 --> 00:03:53,220 is a misunderstanding of of how the game 89 00:03:58,880 --> 00:03:55,799 is played as as near as we can tell 90 00:04:01,729 --> 00:03:58,890 because sometimes the games are exposed 91 00:04:03,830 --> 00:04:01,739 the games the shenanigans that are that 92 00:04:06,050 --> 00:04:03,840 are that these operatives do because 93 00:04:08,180 --> 00:04:06,060 this does happen right I mean so you 94 00:04:11,059 --> 00:04:08,190 think there's somebody telling 72 lat 95 00:04:11,690 --> 00:04:11,069 let me finish no I'm saying the opposite 96 00:04:14,960 --> 00:04:11,700 of that 97 00:04:17,420 --> 00:04:14,970 okay saying that it's so much simpler 98 00:04:19,849 --> 00:04:17,430 than that everyone's running all the 99 00:04:21,379 --> 00:04:19,859 rats are running through the maze all's 100 00:04:23,149 --> 00:04:21,389 you have to do is move the cheese over 101 00:04:26,360 --> 00:04:23,159 here move the cheese over there the rats 102 00:04:27,710 --> 00:04:26,370 but will will adapt you don't know one 103 00:04:33,380 --> 00:04:27,720 has to give Susan 104 00:04:35,030 --> 00:04:33,390 there is no conspiracy no okay that's 105 00:04:37,940 --> 00:04:35,040 not what I'm saying that's now good I'm 106 00:04:41,300 --> 00:04:37,950 saying okay what I'm saying is that the 107 00:04:44,690 --> 00:04:41,310 the opportunity to manipulate and 108 00:04:47,510 --> 00:04:44,700 control the outcome of a group of 109 00:04:50,720 --> 00:04:47,520 scientific studies or a scientific 110 00:04:52,880 --> 00:04:50,730 position doesn't require a smoky back 111 00:04:54,920 --> 00:04:52,890 room where we give marching orders to 112 00:04:57,710 --> 00:04:54,930 people all's we have to do is promote 113 00:04:59,840 --> 00:04:57,720 people that have that espouse a certain 114 00:05:01,100 --> 00:04:59,850 idea that they develop organically and 115 00:05:02,810 --> 00:05:01,110 they're the ones who get promoted 116 00:05:05,240 --> 00:05:02,820 they're the ones who get the idea it's 117 00:05:06,590 --> 00:05:05,250 so what I was going to and I already 118 00:05:08,060 --> 00:05:06,600 gave you this example and you kind of 119 00:05:10,010 --> 00:05:08,070 jumped all over it before I even 120 00:05:11,990 --> 00:05:10,020 finished it I mean there because it is a 121 00:05:14,030 --> 00:05:12,000 sharp guy right I love Richard I'll 122 00:05:16,460 --> 00:05:14,040 adjust and yeah he tells the story over 123 00:05:19,190 --> 00:05:16,470 over and over again of like he's doing 124 00:05:20,510 --> 00:05:19,200 the presentation on you know for example 125 00:05:22,070 --> 00:05:20,520 dogs that know when their owners are 126 00:05:25,909 --> 00:05:22,080 coming home and he says okay here's the 127 00:05:28,520 --> 00:05:25,919 data and his opponent is standing there 128 00:05:30,140 --> 00:05:28,530 with his arms crossed you know look not 129 00:05:33,080 --> 00:05:30,150 looking at the screen and Richard and 130 00:05:35,270 --> 00:05:33,090 and represent well here's the data and 131 00:05:38,630 --> 00:05:35,280 he goes I wouldn't believe it even if it 132 00:05:39,950 --> 00:05:38,640 was true now this isn't a guy who from 133 00:05:42,200 --> 00:05:39,960 the Royal Society right 134 00:05:44,659 --> 00:05:42,210 this is ayats this isn't a guy who's 135 00:05:48,170 --> 00:05:44,669 again been given directives in the 136 00:05:49,909 --> 00:05:48,180 smokey dark room of how do you know it's 137 00:05:52,310 --> 00:05:49,919 just people this just the mainstream 138 00:05:56,150 --> 00:05:52,320 view this is mainstream view that's 139 00:05:57,710 --> 00:05:56,160 cultivated promoted and further advanced 140 00:05:59,840 --> 00:05:57,720 but when you have somebody like Richard 141 00:06:02,000 --> 00:05:59,850 Wiseman who pops up again and again is 142 00:06:04,280 --> 00:06:02,010 called deceptive I mean that is a such a 143 00:06:05,810 --> 00:06:04,290 strong word called deceptive by some of 144 00:06:08,300 --> 00:06:05,820 the most prominent sight or Rupert 145 00:06:10,640 --> 00:06:08,310 Sheldrake Dean Radin Daryl BEM all 146 00:06:13,219 --> 00:06:10,650 citing this guy for being deceptive and 147 00:06:15,500 --> 00:06:13,229 the Darryl Ben case was sold so I don't 148 00:06:16,580 --> 00:06:15,510 know what we're saying Alex are you just 149 00:06:18,020 --> 00:06:16,590 saying that there are some people who 150 00:06:19,969 --> 00:06:18,030 have deceptive and stuck in their ideas 151 00:06:21,500 --> 00:06:19,979 because you're definitely right oh that 152 00:06:23,600 --> 00:06:21,510 there's a mainstream that kind of 153 00:06:24,770 --> 00:06:23,610 perpetuates itself because it brings in 154 00:06:27,830 --> 00:06:24,780 people that agree with it because you're 155 00:06:31,250 --> 00:06:27,840 definitely right remotely to do with a 156 00:06:32,600 --> 00:06:31,260 conspiracy or or some manipulation that 157 00:06:35,839 --> 00:06:32,610 just feels like that's the way the world 158 00:06:39,170 --> 00:06:35,849 works every that's the way the world 159 00:06:41,480 --> 00:06:39,180 works right and if you were the one in 160 00:06:43,370 --> 00:06:41,490 charge of running the world if you 161 00:06:45,980 --> 00:06:43,380 got a vested interest in running the 162 00:06:48,439 --> 00:06:45,990 world and you wanted the world to run a 163 00:06:51,200 --> 00:06:48,449 certain way versus not a certain way 164 00:06:53,620 --> 00:06:51,210 which let's face it I mean somebody does 165 00:06:56,689 --> 00:06:53,630 have a vested interest you know in 166 00:06:59,210 --> 00:06:56,699 whether or not certain ideas are 167 00:07:00,920 --> 00:06:59,220 promoted and advanced in our culture 168 00:07:02,570 --> 00:07:00,930 that makes a difference it makes a 169 00:07:04,400 --> 00:07:02,580 difference economically it makes a 170 00:07:06,950 --> 00:07:04,410 difference socially in terms of how we 171 00:07:09,980 --> 00:07:06,960 control society where society goes all 172 00:07:11,870 --> 00:07:09,990 these things matter so it's it's come 173 00:07:14,450 --> 00:07:11,880 credibly naive to think that someone 174 00:07:16,790 --> 00:07:14,460 wouldn't be interested in how those 175 00:07:18,620 --> 00:07:16,800 things turn out to think so somebody is 176 00:07:21,080 --> 00:07:18,630 got a vested interest in denying 177 00:07:22,460 --> 00:07:21,090 parapsychology outside of this who's 178 00:07:25,510 --> 00:07:22,470 putting the cheese somewhere to get all 179 00:07:28,100 --> 00:07:25,520 of these scientists to run around it and 180 00:07:30,260 --> 00:07:28,110 absolutely there's no and they're really 181 00:07:33,279 --> 00:07:30,270 not interested in parapsychology per se 182 00:07:36,260 --> 00:07:33,289 they're interested in the underlying 183 00:07:39,020 --> 00:07:36,270 idea that you know it's it goes back to 184 00:07:41,540 --> 00:07:39,030 this idea of you know who are you why 185 00:07:44,180 --> 00:07:41,550 are you here well there's a certain 186 00:07:46,129 --> 00:07:44,190 there's differences in terms of what 187 00:07:49,909 --> 00:07:46,139 would be the social implications if we 188 00:07:51,800 --> 00:07:49,919 thought we were all the big words that 189 00:07:53,360 --> 00:07:51,810 we're saying you know if we were this 190 00:07:55,100 --> 00:07:53,370 kind of freewheeling ball of 191 00:07:57,020 --> 00:07:55,110 consciousness that's evolving on our own 192 00:07:58,490 --> 00:07:57,030 and we have these kind of things or if 193 00:08:00,170 --> 00:07:58,500 we're a biological robot in a 194 00:08:01,520 --> 00:08:00,180 meaningless universe I mean I think we 195 00:08:02,629 --> 00:08:01,530 talked about this many times right 196 00:08:06,260 --> 00:08:02,639 because we've had a couple of interviews 197 00:08:08,540 --> 00:08:06,270 together you think it's accident I would 198 00:08:12,830 --> 00:08:08,550 turn it around on YouTube it is a 199 00:08:13,850 --> 00:08:12,840 preposterous notion to think that for 200 00:08:15,890 --> 00:08:13,860 anyone to think that they're a 201 00:08:18,050 --> 00:08:15,900 biological robot and that the 202 00:08:20,360 --> 00:08:18,060 meaningless is universe that the 203 00:08:23,510 --> 00:08:20,370 universe is meaningless devoid of love 204 00:08:26,510 --> 00:08:23,520 devoid of goodness devoid of any it's 205 00:08:28,790 --> 00:08:26,520 it's a preposterous idea yet it's been 206 00:08:30,709 --> 00:08:28,800 perpetuated in science for a long time 207 00:08:32,659 --> 00:08:30,719 you think that's purely accidental do 208 00:08:34,790 --> 00:08:32,669 you think that's just random the way I 209 00:08:36,889 --> 00:08:34,800 certainly don't think there's any vested 210 00:08:38,540 --> 00:08:36,899 interest you know kind of planning the 211 00:08:43,490 --> 00:08:38,550 whole thing out moving it is exit so 212 00:08:45,769 --> 00:08:43,500 then you work you are like that's just 213 00:08:47,569 --> 00:08:45,779 that's just how things turned out man I 214 00:08:49,430 --> 00:08:47,579 know it's it's the matter it's what 215 00:08:51,439 --> 00:08:49,440 happens and I like just in the same way 216 00:08:54,079 --> 00:08:51,449 that that we went through a phase of 217 00:08:55,430 --> 00:08:54,089 believing in in the Christian myth and 218 00:08:57,110 --> 00:08:55,440 that dominated our culture 219 00:08:59,420 --> 00:08:57,120 another idea has come up in opposition 220 00:09:01,069 --> 00:08:59,430 to that that is that tribes why because 221 00:09:02,749 --> 00:09:01,079 it's done very well it has this 222 00:09:04,790 --> 00:09:02,759 reductionist agenda because that makes 223 00:09:06,710 --> 00:09:04,800 sense for it that's how its function now 224 00:09:10,610 --> 00:09:06,720 new ideas will come in to challenge that 225 00:09:12,079 --> 00:09:10,620 that will move on and and within it of 226 00:09:14,569 --> 00:09:12,089 course there's vested interests who want 227 00:09:17,210 --> 00:09:14,579 to maintain what they believe just like 228 00:09:19,030 --> 00:09:17,220 there was in the church but that doesn't 229 00:09:21,439 --> 00:09:19,040 it's a different thing it's much more 230 00:09:23,300 --> 00:09:21,449 organic different it's different how 231 00:09:26,929 --> 00:09:23,310 it's different how in terms of those 232 00:09:28,910 --> 00:09:26,939 vested interests have a reason to want 233 00:09:31,970 --> 00:09:28,920 things to turn out one way or another 234 00:09:33,290 --> 00:09:31,980 but they don't exercise that influence I 235 00:09:34,519 --> 00:09:33,300 don't understand well of course they're 236 00:09:36,829 --> 00:09:34,529 influence of course everyone's doing 237 00:09:39,499 --> 00:09:36,839 that but it's but it's a vastly complex 238 00:09:41,929 --> 00:09:39,509 thing right it's vastly complex some 239 00:09:45,740 --> 00:09:41,939 people wield more societies it's what 240 00:09:48,379 --> 00:09:45,750 society is right some people 241 00:09:51,530 --> 00:09:48,389 collectively get together it's a big 242 00:09:53,449 --> 00:09:51,540 jump that there are some therap of other 243 00:09:55,400 --> 00:09:53,459 than the fact that there is a mainstream 244 00:09:57,189 --> 00:09:55,410 view of science which wants to 245 00:09:59,420 --> 00:09:57,199 perpetuate itself like all views and 246 00:10:00,559 --> 00:09:59,430 that they are going well we don't like 247 00:10:03,110 --> 00:10:00,569 that because it doesn't fit with our 248 00:10:04,730 --> 00:10:03,120 philosophy it would need a major shift 249 00:10:07,689 --> 00:10:04,740 in our philosophy and that's keeping 250 00:10:10,069 --> 00:10:07,699 Rupert out of TED talks for instance and 251 00:10:11,809 --> 00:10:10,079 it's a you know it's a limiting it's a 252 00:10:13,579 --> 00:10:11,819 bad thing and it's not good science and 253 00:10:15,889 --> 00:10:13,589 it's narrow but that's a different thing 254 00:10:18,980 --> 00:10:15,899 - there's a covert agenda behind it 255 00:10:21,019 --> 00:10:18,990 which is even explained or even just 256 00:10:22,960 --> 00:10:21,029 down and you've already pushed me on 257 00:10:26,240 --> 00:10:22,970 that I've already told you it's not some 258 00:10:28,550 --> 00:10:26,250 organized carefully controlled kind of 259 00:10:31,550 --> 00:10:28,560 thing it's more of a free will it is as 260 00:10:33,740 --> 00:10:31,560 you said it's there's various interests 261 00:10:34,939 --> 00:10:33,750 there's various that well what do you 262 00:10:38,780 --> 00:10:34,949 mean that when you say it's not by 263 00:10:40,900 --> 00:10:38,790 accident isn't it is it is certainly not 264 00:10:45,259 --> 00:10:40,910 by accident is that what these do have 265 00:10:48,980 --> 00:10:45,269 we all have interests in the outcome of 266 00:10:51,290 --> 00:10:48,990 these one policy decisions the way that 267 00:10:53,030 --> 00:10:51,300 culture evolves the way that we have we 268 00:10:55,009 --> 00:10:53,040 have a vested interest and the more 269 00:10:56,960 --> 00:10:55,019 powerful we are you know certainly 270 00:10:59,210 --> 00:10:56,970 people that have more money and more 271 00:11:01,549 --> 00:10:59,220 influence have more power and yet may 272 00:11:03,860 --> 00:11:01,559 associate with other people that are 273 00:11:06,319 --> 00:11:03,870 like-minded or they may associate with 274 00:11:08,269 --> 00:11:06,329 people that are saying that just seems 275 00:11:09,230 --> 00:11:08,279 obvious and unconscious I mean it just 276 00:11:12,560 --> 00:11:09,240 feels like well of course 277 00:11:15,139 --> 00:11:12,570 exactly and at some point that power 278 00:11:17,240 --> 00:11:15,149 becomes so great that it becomes the 279 00:11:20,840 --> 00:11:17,250 kind of things we see politically where 280 00:11:23,840 --> 00:11:20,850 we say politically wow you know politics 281 00:11:25,820 --> 00:11:23,850 makes strange bedfellows we say because 282 00:11:28,990 --> 00:11:25,830 here are people that seem to not have 283 00:11:32,090 --> 00:11:29,000 interest but have joined together to 284 00:11:34,840 --> 00:11:32,100 promote a certain belief or a certain 285 00:11:37,490 --> 00:11:34,850 value and then to think that that is all 286 00:11:40,639 --> 00:11:37,500 transparent is going on aboveboard I 287 00:11:43,070 --> 00:11:40,649 think is just it's not only naive it's 288 00:11:44,780 --> 00:11:43,080 counter to what we know as Richard was 289 00:11:47,120 --> 00:11:44,790 saying before if you take if you take 290 00:11:50,420 --> 00:11:47,130 the Gulf of Tonkin incident take it back 291 00:11:52,490 --> 00:11:50,430 to the 9/11 that's now disclosed so they 292 00:11:55,340 --> 00:11:52,500 denied it in the same way that tonight 293 00:11:57,530 --> 00:11:55,350 all this other stuff but now it's 294 00:11:59,210 --> 00:11:57,540 disclosed and it's known where I started 295 00:12:00,620 --> 00:11:59,220 with on this thing was the et thing 296 00:12:02,389 --> 00:12:00,630 which I think you've just kind of 297 00:12:07,040 --> 00:12:02,399 completely glossed over the fact that it 298 00:12:09,170 --> 00:12:07,050 is now disclosed it is disclosed that 299 00:12:11,000 --> 00:12:09,180 it's a reality and but we have to put 300 00:12:14,090 --> 00:12:11,010 that back in the context of you know 301 00:12:15,410 --> 00:12:14,100 Richard Dolan is a really competent UFO 302 00:12:16,970 --> 00:12:15,420 researcher and I certainly don't agree 303 00:12:19,550 --> 00:12:16,980 with him on everything but he wrote a 304 00:12:22,970 --> 00:12:19,560 book a few years ago titled 305 00:12:25,639 --> 00:12:22,980 ad after disclosure and he said you know 306 00:12:28,940 --> 00:12:25,649 there never will be disclosure because 307 00:12:31,550 --> 00:12:28,950 the questions will never never stop the 308 00:12:34,699 --> 00:12:31,560 questions in terms of well why was this 309 00:12:38,000 --> 00:12:34,709 case known of UFOs flying over nuclear 310 00:12:40,130 --> 00:12:38,010 bases and was reported by ten people on 311 00:12:42,380 --> 00:12:40,140 the ground and two people in the silos 312 00:12:45,110 --> 00:12:42,390 and all of us why wasn't that prior to 313 00:12:47,630 --> 00:12:45,120 the American public why was this why was 314 00:12:50,180 --> 00:12:47,640 this individual Paul bennewitz why was 315 00:12:52,730 --> 00:12:50,190 he driven crazy just because he came 316 00:12:56,150 --> 00:12:52,740 forward and why was this information 317 00:12:58,760 --> 00:12:56,160 this campaign to literally drive the guy 318 00:13:01,460 --> 00:12:58,770 crazy to stop disclose the questions 319 00:13:03,889 --> 00:13:01,470 would never stop what happened was 320 00:13:06,889 --> 00:13:03,899 actually absolutely the opposite they 321 00:13:10,190 --> 00:13:06,899 disclosed in December of 17 and no one 322 00:13:12,199 --> 00:13:10,200 said anything and that's the real 323 00:13:14,630 --> 00:13:12,209 question I think the reason that people 324 00:13:16,460 --> 00:13:14,640 didn't say anything is that people 325 00:13:18,620 --> 00:13:16,470 already accept the reality of this 326 00:13:23,090 --> 00:13:18,630 you're on the outside looking in but 327 00:13:25,550 --> 00:13:23,100 most people accept that somehow there 328 00:13:30,200 --> 00:13:25,560 there are there is some intelligent 329 00:13:33,500 --> 00:13:30,210 force powering these devices and they 330 00:13:36,200 --> 00:13:33,510 have some agenda that we don't totally 331 00:13:38,150 --> 00:13:36,210 understand but we better begin to 332 00:13:40,430 --> 00:13:38,160 understand it because it does seem to 333 00:13:43,400 --> 00:13:40,440 intersect with these consciousness 334 00:13:46,070 --> 00:13:43,410 things that we deal about that we that 335 00:13:48,410 --> 00:13:46,080 we care about and the Wilbert Smith memo 336 00:13:50,300 --> 00:13:48,420 that was released in 1950 from the 337 00:13:53,090 --> 00:13:50,310 United States from the Canadian 338 00:13:55,070 --> 00:13:53,100 government that said I've gone to the US 339 00:13:58,850 --> 00:13:55,080 I've talked with people at the highest 340 00:14:00,770 --> 00:13:58,860 level the alien thing is number one on 341 00:14:04,250 --> 00:14:00,780 their list higher than the hydrogen bomb 342 00:14:06,740 --> 00:14:04,260 and there is a mental component to it 343 00:14:07,940 --> 00:14:06,750 that they're very interested in and lo 344 00:14:10,370 --> 00:14:07,950 and behold the next thing you know 345 00:14:11,870 --> 00:14:10,380 they're very interested in MK ULTRA and 346 00:14:14,030 --> 00:14:11,880 lo and behold the next thing they're 347 00:14:16,670 --> 00:14:14,040 very interested in is remote viewing and 348 00:14:19,010 --> 00:14:16,680 they're very interested in the mental 349 00:14:19,580 --> 00:14:19,020 consciousness element and where that 350 00:14:27,110 --> 00:14:19,590 might be 351 00:14:30,080 --> 00:14:27,120 technological component to it and why 352 00:14:32,660 --> 00:14:30,090 wouldn't they because our government if 353 00:14:34,790 --> 00:14:32,670 we accept that we've seeded some power 354 00:14:37,040 --> 00:14:34,800 to them we've given them the power to 355 00:14:40,010 --> 00:14:37,050 protect us and if something is a 356 00:14:42,050 --> 00:14:40,020 potential threat we do hope that they go 357 00:14:44,870 --> 00:14:42,060 out and do it so they've done all these 358 00:14:47,600 --> 00:14:44,880 dirty nasty things in trying to 359 00:14:49,280 --> 00:14:47,610 understand et consciousness and they're 360 00:14:54,740 --> 00:14:49,290 not revealing it and then when they do 361 00:14:58,490 --> 00:14:54,750 reveal it no one cares and these are 362 00:15:00,950 --> 00:14:58,500 that if you investigate it these are the 363 00:15:03,830 --> 00:15:00,960 facts as near as we can tell them so if 364 00:15:08,030 --> 00:15:03,840 you listen you go and talk to dr. David 365 00:15:10,790 --> 00:15:08,040 Jacobs and who's R is research more than 366 00:15:13,940 --> 00:15:10,800 anyone else the abduction thing and and 367 00:15:15,710 --> 00:15:13,950 mary rod well in Australia who I've 368 00:15:16,910 --> 00:15:15,720 interviewed as well and they both have 369 00:15:18,920 --> 00:15:16,920 these different ideas about the 370 00:15:22,220 --> 00:15:18,930 spiritual nature of it but they both say 371 00:15:24,680 --> 00:15:22,230 hey there is a program involved it is it 372 00:15:28,370 --> 00:15:24,690 is something that is happening that has 373 00:15:31,490 --> 00:15:28,380 a goal has an intent has a purpose kind 374 00:15:32,810 --> 00:15:31,500 of thing you know some ideas on the 375 00:15:34,970 --> 00:15:32,820 spiritual nature of it they're not a 376 00:15:36,320 --> 00:15:34,980 little bit like but there is something 377 00:15:41,270 --> 00:15:36,330 going on I mean 378 00:15:44,780 --> 00:15:41,280 we just are not engaging with this most 379 00:15:47,630 --> 00:15:44,790 as Richard said this like number two 380 00:15:50,210 --> 00:15:47,640 thing who are we why are we here number 381 00:15:52,580 --> 00:15:50,220 one I think what Richard actually said 382 00:15:55,280 --> 00:15:52,590 was the the it's that what I heard was 383 00:15:57,020 --> 00:15:55,290 in terms of difficulty to answer the 384 00:15:58,910 --> 00:15:57,030 question so what would tell me what 385 00:16:01,700 --> 00:15:58,920 would you make of that Isis his you know 386 00:16:03,950 --> 00:16:01,710 just some thoughts I have gonna go back 387 00:16:07,850 --> 00:16:03,960 to the UFO thing okay there's no 388 00:16:12,350 --> 00:16:07,860 explanation that works me okay so are 389 00:16:14,750 --> 00:16:12,360 they spiritual or are they eleventh in 390 00:16:16,540 --> 00:16:14,760 some way okay so a lot of people have 391 00:16:18,800 --> 00:16:16,550 traumatic experiences being abducted 392 00:16:20,270 --> 00:16:18,810 then some people have spiritual 393 00:16:22,250 --> 00:16:20,280 experiences some people have traumatic 394 00:16:23,960 --> 00:16:22,260 experiences they may to reinterpret as 395 00:16:25,370 --> 00:16:23,970 spiritual people that take them a level 396 00:16:28,490 --> 00:16:25,380 and view say well that Stockholm 397 00:16:30,020 --> 00:16:28,500 Syndrome okay are they coming from other 398 00:16:32,270 --> 00:16:30,030 worlds well if they're coming from other 399 00:16:36,050 --> 00:16:32,280 worlds you know our son is not 400 00:16:39,140 --> 00:16:36,060 especially young as his sons in this 401 00:16:40,940 --> 00:16:39,150 galaxy go so they could have been coming 402 00:16:42,860 --> 00:16:40,950 here since the time of the dinosaurs 403 00:16:45,260 --> 00:16:42,870 so why they suddenly taken an interest 404 00:16:47,510 --> 00:16:45,270 in anally probing humans you know in 405 00:16:49,490 --> 00:16:47,520 this kind of narrative we have about 406 00:16:51,890 --> 00:16:49,500 abduction it seems to fit in with our 407 00:16:53,510 --> 00:16:51,900 science fiction fantasies more than it 408 00:16:55,490 --> 00:16:53,520 does with what aliens would actually do 409 00:16:57,410 --> 00:16:55,500 if they're really concerned about the 410 00:17:01,430 --> 00:16:57,420 environment which they suggest they are 411 00:17:02,660 --> 00:17:01,440 to certain abductees contact these well 412 00:17:04,580 --> 00:17:02,670 that would seem to be a strange way to 413 00:17:06,140 --> 00:17:04,590 go about it to start picking random 414 00:17:07,370 --> 00:17:06,150 people off the streets and telling them 415 00:17:09,470 --> 00:17:07,380 you know you don't take care of the 416 00:17:11,750 --> 00:17:09,480 environment and so are they 417 00:17:13,880 --> 00:17:11,760 interdimensional is this an outgrowth of 418 00:17:16,040 --> 00:17:13,890 US government program when you talk 419 00:17:17,480 --> 00:17:16,050 about disclosure okay the other scream 420 00:17:20,060 --> 00:17:17,490 on that is of course this always being 421 00:17:21,650 --> 00:17:20,070 the conspiracy theory that wouldn't it 422 00:17:23,510 --> 00:17:21,660 be great if governments could create the 423 00:17:25,040 --> 00:17:23,520 biggest external threat for them all the 424 00:17:27,410 --> 00:17:25,050 biggest Red Scare of them all this 425 00:17:30,260 --> 00:17:27,420 terrorism Thor would be a threat from a 426 00:17:31,820 --> 00:17:30,270 UFO invasion now that doesn't sound very 427 00:17:33,320 --> 00:17:31,830 credible but we're talking about UFOs 428 00:17:35,570 --> 00:17:33,330 here so suddenly anything's on the table 429 00:17:37,640 --> 00:17:35,580 right so I'm not asking you you've like 430 00:17:39,230 --> 00:17:37,650 vastly more experienced the mean and 431 00:17:40,460 --> 00:17:39,240 talk like going into the details there's 432 00:17:42,560 --> 00:17:40,470 so many different people do you have any 433 00:17:45,170 --> 00:17:42,570 sense of making making any sense of the 434 00:17:47,810 --> 00:17:45,180 experience of of you know zooming in and 435 00:17:49,520 --> 00:17:47,820 nailing down what's going on I heard an 436 00:17:49,880 --> 00:17:49,530 interview I heard an interview the other 437 00:17:52,070 --> 00:17:49,890 day 438 00:17:54,100 --> 00:17:52,080 with whitley strieber who of course 439 00:17:58,220 --> 00:17:54,110 wrote the book communion and became 440 00:18:00,710 --> 00:17:58,230 probably the most public guy to come out 441 00:18:02,720 --> 00:18:00,720 and say i've experienced this alien 442 00:18:04,220 --> 00:18:02,730 encounter if you don't want to say 443 00:18:06,649 --> 00:18:04,230 abduction kind of thing and then wrote a 444 00:18:08,029 --> 00:18:06,659 book with a guy we all like dr. jeff 445 00:18:09,350 --> 00:18:08,039 kraebel and they wrote a book on the 446 00:18:12,649 --> 00:18:09,360 supernatural all this stuff but that 447 00:18:17,450 --> 00:18:12,659 here's the time burying the lede much 448 00:18:21,529 --> 00:18:17,460 much stranger and weirder than we could 449 00:18:24,980 --> 00:18:21,539 possibly imagine what if that's the 450 00:18:27,350 --> 00:18:24,990 answer to all those questions and what 451 00:18:29,539 --> 00:18:27,360 if we've built up these barriers who 452 00:18:35,210 --> 00:18:29,549 don't that don't allow us to penetrate 453 00:18:38,930 --> 00:18:35,220 any of that because we keep not wanting 454 00:18:42,320 --> 00:18:38,940 to deal with the ultimate strangeness of 455 00:18:44,240 --> 00:18:42,330 what that is and what i'm guess i'm 456 00:18:46,100 --> 00:18:44,250 really hammering you're very good 457 00:18:47,810 --> 00:18:46,110 natured about this tim i think it makes 458 00:18:49,340 --> 00:18:47,820 for a good dialogue a dialogue that 459 00:18:52,430 --> 00:18:49,350 people need to have and need to hear 460 00:18:54,740 --> 00:18:52,440 both sides of is I'm saying in the in 461 00:18:57,159 --> 00:18:54,750 the way that you so bravely penetrate 462 00:19:01,460 --> 00:18:57,169 all this stuff this needs to be 463 00:19:05,180 --> 00:19:01,470 penetrated fully in an intellectual 464 00:19:09,590 --> 00:19:05,190 thing and the only way to get inside is 465 00:19:13,250 --> 00:19:09,600 to penetrate the outside bubble of don't 466 00:19:15,350 --> 00:19:13,260 be a conspiracy nut yeah be a freaking 467 00:19:18,940 --> 00:19:15,360 conspiracy nut from the beginning 468 00:19:23,120 --> 00:19:18,950 because anything that involves power oh 469 00:19:24,649 --> 00:19:23,130 and or money involves conspiracy I was 470 00:19:26,450 --> 00:19:24,659 in the business world for the longest 471 00:19:28,960 --> 00:19:26,460 time you [\h__\h] kidding me 472 00:19:32,019 --> 00:19:28,970 everything's a [\h__\h] conspiracy 473 00:19:34,940 --> 00:19:32,029 everything as soon as you get above the 474 00:19:38,060 --> 00:19:34,950 assistant manager level at McDonald's 475 00:19:41,240 --> 00:19:38,070 it's all conspiracy in terms of where 476 00:19:43,820 --> 00:19:41,250 you buy your buns and how much ketchup 477 00:19:47,000 --> 00:19:43,830 you use and whether you're gonna get 478 00:19:49,460 --> 00:19:47,010 that corner there that needs to be 479 00:19:52,519 --> 00:19:49,470 rezone by the city but that's gonna take 480 00:19:54,860 --> 00:19:52,529 a little envelope in his under his desk 481 00:19:57,259 --> 00:19:54,870 in order to get it done man that's just 482 00:19:59,899 --> 00:19:57,269 how the world works so when I hear 483 00:20:03,320 --> 00:19:59,909 people object to the basic idea of 484 00:20:03,740 --> 00:20:03,330 conspiracy I'm like man god bless you 485 00:20:06,130 --> 00:20:03,750 what 486 00:20:08,660 --> 00:20:06,140 you lived in because it's not my world 487 00:20:11,330 --> 00:20:08,670 well people do Alex right now I had this 488 00:20:13,520 --> 00:20:11,340 conversation youtube comment section 489 00:20:16,250 --> 00:20:13,530 through the week actually about when 490 00:20:18,140 --> 00:20:16,260 people do and don't see conspiracy okay 491 00:20:20,240 --> 00:20:18,150 it was a comment on I think it's a video 492 00:20:23,450 --> 00:20:20,250 you made on Donald Trump Tim okay and 493 00:20:25,910 --> 00:20:23,460 and the guy I don't know who I was 494 00:20:28,430 --> 00:20:25,920 talking to some internet person but he 495 00:20:32,720 --> 00:20:28,440 cited you and Gordon white as being two 496 00:20:35,510 --> 00:20:32,730 people in the kind of spiritual psy 497 00:20:38,000 --> 00:20:35,520 research world if you like who are more 498 00:20:40,880 --> 00:20:38,010 embracing of things like conspiracy or 499 00:20:43,370 --> 00:20:40,890 have a cynicism towards global warming 500 00:20:45,680 --> 00:20:43,380 okay and we had a discussion about why 501 00:20:47,150 --> 00:20:45,690 people do and don't see things right and 502 00:20:49,160 --> 00:20:47,160 people who have had those kind of 503 00:20:52,550 --> 00:20:49,170 experiences of being in business of 504 00:20:53,870 --> 00:20:52,560 seeing corruption and and come away of 505 00:20:55,970 --> 00:20:53,880 this sense but okay that's how the world 506 00:20:57,860 --> 00:20:55,980 works whereas I think in spiritual 507 00:20:59,420 --> 00:20:57,870 circles you meet different types of 508 00:21:01,220 --> 00:20:59,430 people you meet a long very nice people 509 00:21:03,950 --> 00:21:01,230 who have never had experiences like that 510 00:21:05,840 --> 00:21:03,960 and find it hard to conceptualize the 511 00:21:07,460 --> 00:21:05,850 kind of darkness that could exist behind 512 00:21:09,650 --> 00:21:07,470 the scenes in a government and the kind 513 00:21:10,880 --> 00:21:09,660 of cynicism the court play out there and 514 00:21:14,330 --> 00:21:10,890 the willingness to murder for profit 515 00:21:16,820 --> 00:21:14,340 okay and all by contrast you have people 516 00:21:19,070 --> 00:21:16,830 like I attribute my own conspiratorial 517 00:21:21,410 --> 00:21:19,080 looking to the interest in advisor 518 00:21:22,760 --> 00:21:21,420 pedantic is essentially advisors turning 519 00:21:25,040 --> 00:21:22,770 one's awareness around and looking as 520 00:21:26,750 --> 00:21:25,050 deep as one can look within and they're 521 00:21:29,060 --> 00:21:26,760 not being satisfied of that and keeping 522 00:21:31,340 --> 00:21:29,070 on going going going until you think you 523 00:21:33,410 --> 00:21:31,350 found something or you feel you know 524 00:21:35,600 --> 00:21:33,420 you've found something absolutely solid 525 00:21:37,760 --> 00:21:35,610 and foundational okay so if you turn 526 00:21:39,410 --> 00:21:37,770 that looking around them and you can put 527 00:21:42,080 --> 00:21:39,420 it out into the world of ask okay what 528 00:21:43,910 --> 00:21:42,090 really happened on 9/11 or what really 529 00:21:45,800 --> 00:21:43,920 is the deep state you don't find answers 530 00:21:47,840 --> 00:21:45,810 to that okay you just find this rabbit 531 00:21:51,440 --> 00:21:47,850 hole that keeps on going but you can 532 00:21:56,660 --> 00:21:51,450 find more solidity in knowing what it 533 00:21:57,980 --> 00:21:56,670 isn't and kind of what it is yeah I mean 534 00:21:59,450 --> 00:21:57,990 just to be absolutely clear I don't know 535 00:22:00,890 --> 00:21:59,460 anyone who's watching this or either of 536 00:22:04,400 --> 00:22:00,900 you to think that I don't think that 537 00:22:05,600 --> 00:22:04,410 people conspire I certainly do and I 538 00:22:07,100 --> 00:22:05,610 think it happens all the time I think 539 00:22:09,170 --> 00:22:07,110 sometimes it's conscious and sometimes 540 00:22:12,440 --> 00:22:09,180 it's just a function of people with 541 00:22:15,110 --> 00:22:12,450 similar agendas and sometimes I think it 542 00:22:16,790 --> 00:22:15,120 can be malicious I mean I when I was 543 00:22:17,460 --> 00:22:16,800 younger and very involved in politics I 544 00:22:20,100 --> 00:22:17,470 witnessed you know 545 00:22:24,230 --> 00:22:20,110 and in Chile I wouldn't have one haven't 546 00:22:26,430 --> 00:22:24,240 amigo Aguilar you know I'm very I know 547 00:22:27,570 --> 00:22:26,440 that's obvious that's a large part of 548 00:22:29,880 --> 00:22:27,580 history and as you pointed out actually 549 00:22:31,380 --> 00:22:29,890 really articulately Richard you know you 550 00:22:33,000 --> 00:22:31,390 can just go back through history and see 551 00:22:36,090 --> 00:22:33,010 it again and again and again and again 552 00:22:37,799 --> 00:22:36,100 and and and and people do shore up their 553 00:22:41,909 --> 00:22:37,809 net there their self-interest which 554 00:22:44,760 --> 00:22:41,919 definitely and there's a tendency to to 555 00:22:46,740 --> 00:22:44,770 promote in a skewed way what you agree 556 00:22:50,039 --> 00:22:46,750 with and leave out what you don't agree 557 00:22:54,060 --> 00:22:50,049 with and that's massive and I have no 558 00:22:57,210 --> 00:22:54,070 disagreement with any of that I think 559 00:23:02,190 --> 00:22:57,220 it's for me it's wanting to be careful 560 00:23:03,480 --> 00:23:02,200 that we can not see and I met and maybe 561 00:23:04,919 --> 00:23:03,490 I've misunderstood some of the things 562 00:23:07,320 --> 00:23:04,929 you're saying Alex because of this 563 00:23:10,020 --> 00:23:07,330 because the thing which I want to avoid 564 00:23:13,590 --> 00:23:10,030 is assuming there is some nefarious 565 00:23:15,630 --> 00:23:13,600 hands behind everything and that we're 566 00:23:19,680 --> 00:23:15,640 that we end up with this plethora of 567 00:23:21,899 --> 00:23:19,690 things which the the every single idea 568 00:23:24,149 --> 00:23:21,909 which gets called a conspiracy theory is 569 00:23:27,000 --> 00:23:24,159 a separate idea they're not all the same 570 00:23:29,250 --> 00:23:27,010 idea and some of them may be that's a 571 00:23:31,820 --> 00:23:29,260 good way to round this up because we've 572 00:23:35,990 --> 00:23:31,830 been at it for a long time and we have 573 00:23:38,610 --> 00:23:36,000 thing is to uh what I'd suggest is that 574 00:23:40,860 --> 00:23:38,620 we return to the very beginning of what 575 00:23:43,380 --> 00:23:40,870 we're talking about in that maybe the 576 00:23:45,060 --> 00:23:43,390 solution is the fluidity that Richard 577 00:23:47,820 --> 00:23:45,070 was talking about because that's what 578 00:23:50,279 --> 00:23:47,830 I'd advocate and and but I find that so 579 00:23:53,430 --> 00:23:50,289 many people in in your camp if I can say 580 00:23:55,289 --> 00:23:53,440 so to thank Tim all right are now Lily 581 00:23:58,260 --> 00:23:55,299 to jump back and forth so it's like hey 582 00:23:59,970 --> 00:23:58,270 why not take a complete conspiratorial 583 00:24:03,600 --> 00:23:59,980 view so this is tantamount to the 584 00:24:05,580 --> 00:24:03,610 materialist versus the idealist so I'm 585 00:24:07,440 --> 00:24:05,590 gonna be completely conspiratorial I'm 586 00:24:10,200 --> 00:24:07,450 gonna say everything's a frickin 587 00:24:13,500 --> 00:24:10,210 conspiracy until you prove otherwise and 588 00:24:16,370 --> 00:24:13,510 that can be my materialist point of view 589 00:24:18,659 --> 00:24:16,380 and and then I can switch over and say 590 00:24:23,430 --> 00:24:18,669 nothing is a conspiracy 591 00:24:25,560 --> 00:24:23,440 unless it's proven to the nth degree and 592 00:24:28,500 --> 00:24:25,570 that's going to be my idealist view and 593 00:24:30,990 --> 00:24:28,510 maybe the real magic in this is to be 594 00:24:34,050 --> 00:24:31,000 able to move back and forth 595 00:24:38,100 --> 00:24:34,060 but what does kind of piss me off is 596 00:24:40,620 --> 00:24:38,110 this idea that oh no to to start with 597 00:24:43,380 --> 00:24:40,630 everything from a conspiratorial point 598 00:24:44,880 --> 00:24:43,390 of view oh that would just be that would 599 00:24:46,260 --> 00:24:44,890 just be wrong why would we want to do 600 00:24:47,880 --> 00:24:46,270 that what would the reason we want to do 601 00:24:50,760 --> 00:24:47,890 that is because that's what the world 602 00:24:52,740 --> 00:24:50,770 has told us so I'm okay with moving back 603 00:24:55,350 --> 00:24:52,750 and forth and saying you know I need to 604 00:24:57,660 --> 00:24:55,360 I need to fluidly move between both but 605 00:25:00,600 --> 00:24:57,670 I'm not okay with saying one of those is 606 00:25:04,020 --> 00:25:00,610 somehow superior to the other because 607 00:25:06,210 --> 00:25:04,030 being starting conspiratorial II first 608 00:25:08,970 --> 00:25:06,220 before it's disproven makes a lot of 609 00:25:10,530 --> 00:25:08,980 sense to me well I think you are okay 610 00:25:12,780 --> 00:25:10,540 with saying what is superior to the 611 00:25:14,820 --> 00:25:12,790 other right I know I would be I totally 612 00:25:16,680 --> 00:25:14,830 agree that was how I got back into the 613 00:25:19,230 --> 00:25:16,690 conspiratorial research was to look at 614 00:25:21,660 --> 00:25:19,240 it that way and say okay the world is an 615 00:25:24,120 --> 00:25:21,670 unknown event there are different ways 616 00:25:27,330 --> 00:25:24,130 we can explain it different lenses we 617 00:25:28,980 --> 00:25:27,340 can look through no one lens shows us 618 00:25:30,630 --> 00:25:28,990 everything now it might be that one day 619 00:25:32,130 --> 00:25:30,640 one doors it might be that actually we 620 00:25:33,990 --> 00:25:32,140 find the lens that says it's all been 621 00:25:35,700 --> 00:25:34,000 the Illuminati from ancient Babylon 622 00:25:38,280 --> 00:25:35,710 that's the right one but we don't know 623 00:25:39,960 --> 00:25:38,290 that yet so the best way is to look at 624 00:25:41,970 --> 00:25:39,970 it through different lenses and say okay 625 00:25:43,350 --> 00:25:41,980 yep through one lens you can say it's a 626 00:25:45,330 --> 00:25:43,360 conspiracy or through and northern but 627 00:25:47,400 --> 00:25:45,340 all that's very accidental or another 628 00:25:48,810 --> 00:25:47,410 one might be its structural okay like 629 00:25:51,420 --> 00:25:48,820 the state is set up in different way 630 00:25:53,160 --> 00:25:51,430 like in 1786 or never in America and 631 00:25:55,050 --> 00:25:53,170 that led to inevitable outcomes because 632 00:25:57,810 --> 00:25:55,060 of just the structure of the thing and 633 00:26:00,030 --> 00:25:57,820 all of those lenses shed a light and 634 00:26:01,470 --> 00:26:00,040 where I think you and Tim perhaps talk 635 00:26:03,210 --> 00:26:01,480 past each other and I might be a bit 636 00:26:07,320 --> 00:26:03,220 closer to your worldview 637 00:26:08,820 --> 00:26:07,330 Alec so I maybe talk past him um on this 638 00:26:10,770 --> 00:26:08,830 issue too I mean I mean talking past I 639 00:26:13,770 --> 00:26:10,780 mean cuz we're in different paradigms on 640 00:26:16,950 --> 00:26:13,780 an issue like global warming well I do 641 00:26:19,530 --> 00:26:16,960 think it's relevant the paradigm is you 642 00:26:21,210 --> 00:26:19,540 need a certain depth of conspiracy to 643 00:26:22,920 --> 00:26:21,220 believe that global warming as a 644 00:26:24,600 --> 00:26:22,930 conspiracy could emerge out of that you 645 00:26:25,890 --> 00:26:24,610 need a certain death the leaps think 646 00:26:28,230 --> 00:26:25,900 that rabbit hole needs to go a certain 647 00:26:30,180 --> 00:26:28,240 way otherwise it doesn't make sense so 648 00:26:31,260 --> 00:26:30,190 whether it's right or wrong whether you 649 00:26:33,030 --> 00:26:31,270 stay there or not you need to go to 650 00:26:34,200 --> 00:26:33,040 shift into seeing oh okay this is why 651 00:26:36,180 --> 00:26:34,210 people would think this because they 652 00:26:37,800 --> 00:26:36,190 think that you know like let's take the 653 00:26:40,080 --> 00:26:37,810 Rockefellers and their foundation that's 654 00:26:42,750 --> 00:26:40,090 like being very prominent in in US 655 00:26:44,669 --> 00:26:42,760 history in health and education and also 656 00:26:48,149 --> 00:26:44,679 have the clout to influence the 657 00:26:50,279 --> 00:26:48,159 formation of the ipcc of the UN etc and 658 00:26:53,220 --> 00:26:50,289 that's where global warming comes from 659 00:26:54,899 --> 00:26:53,230 because it's it's an effort to control 660 00:26:56,159 --> 00:26:54,909 global energy supplies right now I'm not 661 00:26:58,710 --> 00:26:56,169 saying that's true but I'm saying that's 662 00:27:00,869 --> 00:26:58,720 the conspiratorial paradigm which I 663 00:27:02,159 --> 00:27:00,879 would say I think also has a place at 664 00:27:04,230 --> 00:27:02,169 the table when we're having the 665 00:27:06,359 --> 00:27:04,240 discussion alongside that yeah but 666 00:27:10,100 --> 00:27:06,369 global warming is a real threat and and 667 00:27:18,060 --> 00:27:16,590 Tim final words Wow when you said when 668 00:27:20,460 --> 00:27:18,070 you invited me to take part in this 669 00:27:22,529 --> 00:27:20,470 discussion and you listed all the things 670 00:27:24,090 --> 00:27:22,539 you wanted to talk about I said to 671 00:27:28,830 --> 00:27:24,100 Richard wow that's never gonna happen 672 00:27:32,460 --> 00:27:28,840 but it has you've taken us on that 673 00:27:34,619 --> 00:27:32,470 journey it's been a while I wonder what 674 00:27:37,080 --> 00:27:34,629 people will make of being part of it and 675 00:27:39,090 --> 00:27:37,090 listening to it it's been wonderful it's 676 00:27:40,710 --> 00:27:39,100 been fascinating I you know I I 677 00:27:44,070 --> 00:27:40,720 certainly don't want to give the 678 00:27:47,039 --> 00:27:44,080 impression that I think these views are 679 00:27:50,899 --> 00:27:47,049 ill informed or just unintelligent I 680 00:27:53,700 --> 00:27:50,909 don't what I but I do what I think I 681 00:27:56,430 --> 00:27:53,710 think the truth is probably what Richard 682 00:27:59,039 --> 00:27:56,440 said earlier which is on every side of 683 00:28:00,960 --> 00:27:59,049 an argument like this word discussion 684 00:28:02,340 --> 00:28:00,970 like this there are people who are well 685 00:28:03,899 --> 00:28:02,350 informed of thought things through and 686 00:28:05,960 --> 00:28:03,909 have reached the conclusion for a reason 687 00:28:08,279 --> 00:28:05,970 and then there's people who haven't and 688 00:28:09,659 --> 00:28:08,289 inevitably if you are in one side it's 689 00:28:10,950 --> 00:28:09,669 very easy to see the other people on the 690 00:28:14,009 --> 00:28:10,960 other side who are the people that 691 00:28:16,730 --> 00:28:14,019 haven't so there is a lot of people I 692 00:28:18,359 --> 00:28:16,740 think in the conspiracy world who seem 693 00:28:20,700 --> 00:28:18,369 uninformed to the point of being 694 00:28:22,169 --> 00:28:20,710 unhinged but that's not but I'm sure 695 00:28:23,340 --> 00:28:22,179 that's true on the other side and every 696 00:28:25,859 --> 00:28:23,350 side because there's just a lot of 697 00:28:27,779 --> 00:28:25,869 people in humanity who are ill informed 698 00:28:29,340 --> 00:28:27,789 to the point of being unhinged and we 699 00:28:31,320 --> 00:28:29,350 shouldn't let that blind to us that they 700 00:28:33,090 --> 00:28:31,330 can be serious points to be made and I 701 00:28:35,909 --> 00:28:33,100 think which it has functioned very well 702 00:28:38,129 --> 00:28:35,919 in bringing that through and as somebody 703 00:28:39,840 --> 00:28:38,139 who thinks para logically I think it's 704 00:28:40,950 --> 00:28:39,850 absolutely imperative to be able to see 705 00:28:43,259 --> 00:28:40,960 it from these different points of view 706 00:28:47,010 --> 00:28:43,269 and the place I tend to end up is 707 00:28:50,710 --> 00:28:47,020 usually it's a bit of all of it 708 00:28:53,560 --> 00:28:50,720 well I didn't mean for it to take this 709 00:28:55,480 --> 00:28:53,570 long and to chew up such a big part of 710 00:28:58,450 --> 00:28:55,490 your evening but I'm glad it did is an 711 00:29:00,490 --> 00:28:58,460 awesome conversation and it's just great 712 00:29:03,370 --> 00:29:00,500 to connect with you guys again our 713 00:29:07,000 --> 00:29:03,380 guests have been Tim freek and Richard 714 00:29:09,040 --> 00:29:07,010 Cox check out Tim freaks website for his 715 00:29:12,100 --> 00:29:09,050 excellent books and if you do have a 716 00:29:14,860 --> 00:29:12,110 chance to see him in person to attend 717 00:29:16,300 --> 00:29:14,870 one of his events which we never got 718 00:29:18,610 --> 00:29:16,310 around to speaking of just speaking 719 00:29:20,500 --> 00:29:18,620 about but he's become much more he's 720 00:29:22,870 --> 00:29:20,510 become even more active kind of reaping 721 00:29:24,880 --> 00:29:22,880 his game in terms of getting out there 722 00:29:27,280 --> 00:29:24,890 so if he comes to your neighborhood 723 00:29:30,220 --> 00:29:27,290 check it out great and he is coming to 724 00:29:32,230 --> 00:29:30,230 the u.s. right Tim I am I'm coming I'm 725 00:29:34,900 --> 00:29:32,240 coming to New York to give a talk on 726 00:29:37,000 --> 00:29:34,910 evolution and spirituality and my new 727 00:29:39,220 --> 00:29:37,010 book our soul story on the 9th of 728 00:29:41,500 --> 00:29:39,230 October and then I'm running a retreat 729 00:29:43,660 --> 00:29:41,510 at the Omega Institute so maybe to take 730 00:29:46,120 --> 00:29:43,670 it back to that warm feeling we started 731 00:29:48,850 --> 00:29:46,130 with run the rather dark feeling of us 732 00:29:50,590 --> 00:29:48,860 being manipulated there is without doubt 733 00:29:52,600 --> 00:29:50,600 I know you agree with this Alex there is 734 00:29:54,970 --> 00:29:52,610 a place where you can you know you can 735 00:29:56,440 --> 00:29:54,980 go deep inside and there is this deep 736 00:29:58,960 --> 00:29:56,450 knowing and this this is enormous love 737 00:30:02,050 --> 00:29:58,970 and my my day job when I'm not having 738 00:30:03,910 --> 00:30:02,060 discussions review is to take people to 739 00:30:06,430 --> 00:30:03,920 that direct experience and that's what 740 00:30:07,990 --> 00:30:06,440 I'm going to be doing that gnosis at the 741 00:30:10,720 --> 00:30:08,000 deeper wakening retreat which is at the 742 00:30:14,620 --> 00:30:10,730 Omega Institute at the 12th to the 14th 743 00:30:17,890 --> 00:30:14,630 of October and and and that is a that is 744 00:30:20,530 --> 00:30:17,900 a way of coming out of all of this into 745 00:30:23,140 --> 00:30:20,540 something very very very deep indeed I 746 00:30:26,080 --> 00:30:23,150 think that's really a profound and 747 00:30:29,710 --> 00:30:26,090 important point that I was saving to the 748 00:30:31,930 --> 00:30:29,720 end and I didn't kind of get there and 749 00:30:33,340 --> 00:30:31,940 that's that you know you're coming at 750 00:30:36,190 --> 00:30:33,350 this from a different angle 751 00:30:39,190 --> 00:30:36,200 but ultimately what you just said is my 752 00:30:41,680 --> 00:30:39,200 ultimate bottom line too and that's the 753 00:30:43,630 --> 00:30:41,690 way I put it is the way Mickey singer 754 00:30:45,940 --> 00:30:43,640 who wrote the book the untethered soul 755 00:30:49,600 --> 00:30:45,950 what's it is that the secret of the 756 00:30:52,950 --> 00:30:49,610 ascent is to always look up so the 757 00:30:58,030 --> 00:30:52,960 secret to the ascent is to find that 758 00:31:00,549 --> 00:30:58,040 love head that God had that and you know 759 00:31:02,590 --> 00:31:00,559 that's the problem I see is 760 00:31:04,539 --> 00:31:02,600 with the conspiracy world not the 761 00:31:07,779 --> 00:31:04,549 problem that you said not that people 762 00:31:10,810 --> 00:31:07,789 are unhinged or that they're over 763 00:31:15,009 --> 00:31:10,820 involved or any of that is that they 764 00:31:17,950 --> 00:31:15,019 don't see a way out and that's because 765 00:31:20,710 --> 00:31:17,960 the way out is a spiritual path that 766 00:31:23,070 --> 00:31:20,720 completely bypasses all this nonsense 767 00:31:25,110 --> 00:31:23,080 and if people want to play these games 768 00:31:28,299 --> 00:31:25,120 people have been playing these games 769 00:31:30,789 --> 00:31:28,309 since the beginning and your book Jesus 770 00:31:34,210 --> 00:31:30,799 mysteries is really about what I think 771 00:31:36,519 --> 00:31:34,220 how governmental powers at the time the 772 00:31:41,470 --> 00:31:36,529 Roman Empire saw an opportunity it kind 773 00:31:44,109 --> 00:31:41,480 of it's complicated but one one element 774 00:31:47,859 --> 00:31:44,119 of it at some point had to be some 775 00:31:49,600 --> 00:31:47,869 control improved ability so this has 776 00:31:52,749 --> 00:31:49,610 been going on for a long time the secret 777 00:31:55,060 --> 00:31:52,759 of the ascent is to always look up and 778 00:31:56,950 --> 00:31:55,070 that's what I find in your work and 779 00:31:59,379 --> 00:31:56,960 that's what I think you're really all 780 00:32:00,639 --> 00:31:59,389 about and that's why we we connect and 781 00:32:04,180 --> 00:32:00,649 resonate because I know this other stuff 782 00:32:06,639 --> 00:32:04,190 really matters all that much you know 783 00:32:08,109 --> 00:32:06,649 beautifully put I love that well we just 784 00:32:10,389 --> 00:32:08,119 spent three hours talking about stuff 785 00:32:12,190 --> 00:32:10,399 that doesn't matter I guess Richard any 786 00:32:14,289 --> 00:32:12,200 closing comments I do want people to 787 00:32:15,879 --> 00:32:14,299 check out the deep state consciousness 788 00:32:18,940 --> 00:32:15,889 podcast because you're doing an awesome 789 00:32:20,859 --> 00:32:18,950 job there my man I commend your work and 790 00:32:22,869 --> 00:32:20,869 I think people are waiting for the next 791 00:32:24,700 --> 00:32:22,879 skeptical episode to come out I'd be 792 00:32:26,830 --> 00:32:24,710 delighted if they did and I might just 793 00:32:29,820 --> 00:32:26,840 plug also people might be interested in 794 00:32:33,480 --> 00:32:29,830 I've been working on a story recently 795 00:32:36,100 --> 00:32:33,490 looking at spirituality in relation to 796 00:32:38,619 --> 00:32:36,110 principally body image dissatisfaction 797 00:32:40,289 --> 00:32:38,629 okay so taking a transpersonal approach 798 00:32:44,039 --> 00:32:40,299 to that where I've drawn in things like 799 00:32:46,690 --> 00:32:44,049 the practicalities of idealism and 800 00:32:49,029 --> 00:32:46,700 near-death experience and had white a 801 00:32:50,289 --> 00:32:49,039 bird and her and such things and by the 802 00:32:51,700 --> 00:32:50,299 time this comes out that should be 803 00:32:54,730 --> 00:32:51,710 published it might be an interesting 804 00:32:57,220 --> 00:32:54,740 thing for Google to read and I also run 805 00:32:59,379 --> 00:32:57,230 a monthly group particularly in a 806 00:33:01,960 --> 00:32:59,389 relevant to skeptical looking at death 807 00:33:04,690 --> 00:33:01,970 and bereavement from the kind of NDE 808 00:33:07,389 --> 00:33:04,700 after death communication perspective as 809 00:33:10,330 --> 00:33:07,399 a way of practically engaging with that 810 00:33:12,129 --> 00:33:10,340 and looking as what it is as a practical 811 00:33:13,440 --> 00:33:12,139 kind of thing from the whole continuing 812 00:33:14,940 --> 00:33:13,450 Vons paradigm there anymore 813 00:33:18,000 --> 00:33:14,950 come along - that's just something I do 814 00:33:20,159 --> 00:33:18,010 for and you know for the benefits of it 815 00:33:23,730 --> 00:33:20,169 and so that I think they're the things 816 00:33:25,279 --> 00:33:23,740 I'd like to mention and closing comments 817 00:33:29,730 --> 00:33:25,289 yeah it's been a it's been a great 818 00:33:31,169 --> 00:33:29,740 discussion you know I just be interested 819 00:33:33,180 --> 00:33:31,179 in what people's responses are do it 820 00:33:36,480 --> 00:33:33,190 really so yeah thanks very much Alex and 821 00:33:38,730 --> 00:33:36,490 Tim yeah it's like I have you guys thank 822 00:33:40,230 --> 00:33:38,740 you thank you both very much really 823 00:33:41,850 --> 00:33:40,240 appreciate it thanks for watching this 824 00:33:44,549 --> 00:33:41,860 video that it wasn't really available 825 00:33:46,529 --> 00:33:44,559 just an audio I stored as a video I 826 00:33:48,570 --> 00:33:46,539 apologize but there's more videos out 827 00:33:50,519 --> 00:33:48,580 there as well but please check out the 828 00:33:51,870 --> 00:33:50,529 skeptic Oh website you can see it here 829 00:33:54,269 --> 00:33:51,880 we cover a lot of different stuff you 830 00:33:57,360 --> 00:33:54,279 might be interested in relating to 831 00:34:00,419 --> 00:33:57,370 controversial science and spirituality a 832 00:34:02,850 --> 00:34:00,429 lot of shows up there over 350 of them 833 00:34:06,360 --> 00:34:02,860 or so all free all available for 834 00:34:10,850 --> 00:34:06,370 downloads so do check it out 835 00:34:12,899 --> 00:34:10,860 [Music]